Comments on: Pir Babas http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html Pakistan Politics, Current Affairs, Business and Lifestyle Fri, 19 Mar 2010 22:20:36 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0 by: Momina http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276868 Tue, 04 Aug 2009 08:42:04 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276868 I wonder what the new definition of Muslim is if one has to observe these grave-worshippers. Hindus worship idols; they worship graves. Hindus ask ram, krishna etc for help; they ask Khwaja, Data, Dastagir etc for help. Hindus bring coconuts, incense sticks, flowers etc to their temples to make their idols happy; they take the same to the darghas. Hindus have pundits (collectors); they have the mujawars. Hindus hold grand <i>yathras</i> on yearly basis; they hold yearly <i>julus</i> in the peer/baba's name. Hindus have songs-<i>bhajans</i>-in praise of their idols; they conduct <i>qawwalis</i> for the same purpose. Hindus prostrate and circumbulate in temples; they do the same in darghas. Hindus sacrifice-<i>bali</i>-humans and animal to their idols; they sacrifice animals to their peers/babas. Both have peacock feathers to ride devils away. When we ask learned Hindus why do you worship idols? they reply they not gods but God's avatars kept to increase our concentration and they help us in achieving nearness to God. Grave-worshippers have a similar reply. the babas are not dead they are living (surprise!), we call on them to help us in achieving nearness to God. Allah has said regarding the grave-worshippers: <b>Surely the religion (i.e. the worship and obedience) is for Allah alone. And those who take <i>Auliya'</i> (protectors, helpers, lords, gods) besides Him (say): "We worship them only that they may bring us near to Allah." Verily, Allah will judge between them concerning that wherein they differ. Truly, Allah guides not him who is a liar, and a disbeliever. [Qur'an, Al-Zumar: 3] Those whom they (Mushrikeen) invoke besides Allah have not created anything, but are themselves created. They are dead, not alive; and they know not when they will be raised up. [Qur'an, Al-Nahl: 20-21]</b> The 'Aaqileen will know the truth. Allaho 'Alam I wonder what the new definition of Muslim is if one has to observe these grave-worshippers.

Hindus worship idols; they worship graves.

Hindus ask ram, krishna etc for help; they ask Khwaja, Data, Dastagir etc for help.

Hindus bring coconuts, incense sticks, flowers etc to their temples to make their idols happy; they take the same to the darghas.

Hindus have pundits (collectors); they have the mujawars.

Hindus hold grand yathras on yearly basis; they hold yearly julus in the peer/baba’s name.

Hindus have songs-bhajans-in praise of their idols; they conduct qawwalis for the same purpose.

Hindus prostrate and circumbulate in temples; they do the same in darghas.

Hindus sacrifice-bali-humans and animal to their idols; they sacrifice animals to their peers/babas.

Both have peacock feathers to ride devils away.

When we ask learned Hindus why do you worship idols? they reply they not gods but God’s avatars kept to increase our concentration and they help us in achieving nearness to God.

Grave-worshippers have a similar reply. the babas are not dead they are living (surprise!), we call on them to help us in achieving nearness to God.

Allah has said regarding the grave-worshippers:

Surely the religion (i.e. the worship and obedience) is for Allah alone. And those who take Auliya’ (protectors, helpers, lords, gods) besides Him (say): “We worship them only that they may bring us near to Allah.”
Verily, Allah will judge between them concerning that wherein they differ. Truly, Allah guides not him who is a liar, and a disbeliever. [Qur’an, Al-Zumar: 3]

Those whom they (Mushrikeen) invoke besides Allah have not created anything, but are themselves created.
They are dead, not alive; and they know not when they will be raised up. [Qur’an, Al-Nahl: 20-21]

The ‘Aaqileen will know the truth.

Allaho ‘Alam

]]> by: Momina http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276758 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 19:08:41 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276758 *Sahabi (r.a.) *Sahabi (r.a.)

]]> by: Momina http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276757 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 19:07:30 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276757 @Shakir Lakhani: the 'followers' of Ali r.a.? i think you mean Rafidis, who incorrectly continue to attribute the status of god to the Sahabah, the Ameer-ul-Mo'mineen Ali r.a. (Check Usool Kaafi) Ali r.a. ordered that the the first person, the accursed abdullah ibn sabah, who told Ali r.a., 'You are the One' (Na'oodhubillah), to be burned alive for saying such a thing. But his companions advised him not to take such a decision due to the political unrest at that time. ibn sabah was exiled. Ali r.a. narrated. the Prophet s.a.w.w. told Ali r.a. that a time will come when two groups will come into being. one of which will proclaim so much love for you that they will give you a status that you do not deserve (Rafidis). the other group would hate you so much that they would not accept what your rightful status is (Naasibis). and both are from the dwellers of hell. As for the graves being demolished. They were notdemolished but levelled. The domes built on the graves were removed. Some Ahadith in this regard: Imam Muslim narrated in his Sahih via Abu al-Hayyaj al-Asadi (Allah be pleased with him) that he said, “`Ali bin Abi Talib asked me, “Shall I not send you to do what the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) sent me to do?—That you leave no figure except that you erase it, nor an elevated grave except that you level it.” Imam Muslim also narrated via Jabir that he said, “The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) forbade the plastering of graves, sitting on them, or building over them.” Imam Shafi`i said in his book, al-Umm, “I have seen the scholars of Makkah command the demolition of [graves] that are built over. Such demolition is supported by the hadith, “… nor an elevated grave except that you level it …”” The Prophet s.a.w.w. repeatedly condemned grave-worshipping: “Beware of those who preceded you and used to take the graves of their prophets and righteous men as places of worship, but you must not take graves as mosques; I forbid you to do that.” (Sahih Muslim) “May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of their Prophets.” (Sahih Bukhari) “If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection.” (Sahih Bukhari) “Do not sit on the graves and do not pray facing towards them.” (Sahih Bukhari) Grave-worshipping was present in Arabia...many evil things were present...a lot before the Risalat and then a lot gradually after the salaf. But with some great effort that has reduced considerably. (i am not sure if this practise is fully exterminated). Insha'Allah, the sub-continent will also be clean of this nonsense some day. Only about 5% of the peers are like 'psychiatrists'. @Shakir Lakhani: the ‘followers’ of Ali r.a.? i think you mean Rafidis, who incorrectly continue to attribute the status of god to the Sahabah, the Ameer-ul-Mo’mineen Ali r.a. (Check Usool Kaafi)

Ali r.a. ordered that the the first person, the accursed abdullah ibn sabah, who told Ali r.a., ‘You are the One’ (Na’oodhubillah), to be burned alive for saying such a thing. But his companions advised him not to take such a decision due to the political unrest at that time. ibn sabah was exiled.

Ali r.a. narrated. the Prophet s.a.w.w. told Ali r.a. that a time will come when two groups will come into being. one of which will proclaim so much love for you that they will give you a status that you do not deserve (Rafidis). the other group would hate you so much that they would not accept what your rightful status is (Naasibis). and both are from the dwellers of hell.

As for the graves being demolished. They were notdemolished but levelled. The domes built on the graves were removed.

Some Ahadith in this regard:

Imam Muslim narrated in his Sahih via Abu al-Hayyaj al-Asadi (Allah be pleased with him) that he said,

“`Ali bin Abi Talib asked me, “Shall I not send you to do what the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) sent me to do?—That you leave no figure except that you erase it, nor an elevated grave except that you level it.”

Imam Muslim also narrated via Jabir that he said, “The Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him and give him peace) forbade the plastering of graves, sitting on them, or building over them.”

Imam Shafi`i said in his book, al-Umm, “I have seen the scholars of Makkah command the demolition of [graves] that are built over. Such demolition is supported by the hadith, “… nor an elevated grave except that you level it …””

The Prophet s.a.w.w. repeatedly condemned grave-worshipping:

“Beware of those who preceded you and used to take the graves of their prophets and righteous men as places of worship, but you must not take graves as mosques; I forbid you to do that.” (Sahih Muslim)

“May Allah curse the Jews and Christians for they built the places of worship at the graves of their Prophets.” (Sahih Bukhari)

“If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection.” (Sahih Bukhari)

“Do not sit on the graves and do not pray facing towards them.” (Sahih Bukhari)

Grave-worshipping was present in Arabia…many evil things were present…a lot before the Risalat and then a lot gradually after the salaf. But with some great effort that has reduced considerably. (i am not sure if this practise is fully exterminated). Insha’Allah, the sub-continent will also be clean of this nonsense some day.

Only about 5% of the peers are like ‘psychiatrists’.

]]> by: Irfan http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276756 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 19:03:01 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276756 @Shakir Whatever the Saudis did was absolutely right, i wish we could someday also do the same in our country.Regarding,your question that why should we be worried, so in my humble opinion, its the result to these prevailing Bidaats, in our country, that we are mired in all sorts of turmoils.We are going away from the teachings of Quran and Sunnah,and intentionally or unintentionally majority of the people in this country doing SHIRK.Thereby, inviting the wrath of Allah Almighty,because of our wrongful deeds. There is a wrong misperception among the masses in Pakistan, that since Pakistan got independence on 27th of Ramadan,so we need to worry, this country to going to remain forever, as the people of this country are the chosen and the blessed lot (like Bani Israel). We need to condemn all sorts of Bidaats,and those people who are spreading those in our country.Most of the rituals which we follow,are borrowed from the Hindu culture. I am sure you must be aware of a shrine in Southern Punjab,where there is a door named as "BAHISTI DARWAZA" where every year(on Annual Urs) so many devotees gather to pass through that door in order to enter Junnah.What a pity. The root cause of all these problem is that most of the people in our country are blindly following their village/town maulvis/Pirs.No one is trying to understand the religion himself. @Shakir
Whatever the Saudis did was absolutely right, i wish we could someday also do the same in our country.Regarding,your question that why should we be worried, so in my humble opinion, its the result to these prevailing Bidaats, in our country, that we are mired in all sorts of turmoils.We are going away from the teachings of Quran and Sunnah,and intentionally or unintentionally majority of the people in this country doing SHIRK.Thereby, inviting the wrath of Allah Almighty,because of our wrongful deeds.
There is a wrong misperception among the masses in Pakistan, that since Pakistan got independence on 27th of Ramadan,so we need to worry, this country to going to remain forever, as the people of this country are the chosen and the blessed lot (like Bani Israel).
We need to condemn all sorts of Bidaats,and those people who are spreading those in our country.Most of the rituals which we follow,are borrowed from the Hindu culture.
I am sure you must be aware of a shrine in Southern Punjab,where there is a door named as “BAHISTI DARWAZA” where every year(on Annual Urs) so many devotees gather to pass through that door in order to enter Junnah.What a pity.
The root cause of all these problem is that most of the people in our country are blindly following their village/town maulvis/Pirs.No one is trying to understand the religion himself.

]]> by: sunni muslim http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276754 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 18:38:41 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276754 salaams Shakir please make dua our progeny donot follow the evils of the Soofie progeny. it is a worry definetly our people are been mislead by their greedy Peers back to the days of ignorance ,Allah save us all Ameen. salaams Shakir please make dua our progeny donot follow the evils of the Soofie progeny. it is a worry definetly our people are been mislead by their greedy Peers back to the days of ignorance ,Allah save us all Ameen.

]]> by: Shakir Lakhani http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276740 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 16:58:10 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276740 Years ago, I read that some followers of Hazrat Ali claimed that he was God, but Ali forbade them from saying such a thing. As for grave-worshipping, although it is definitely against the principles of Islam, why is it practised by the majority of Muslims in the sub-continent? As a matter of fact, the Saudis destroyed 3000 to 5000 graves and monuments when they seized power in 1921 (there were demonstrations in undivided India against the Saudis at the time). This proves that even in Arabia (before Saudi rule), grave-worshipping was going on all the time. As for "peers", they're like psychiatrists, they advise their followers in all matters. And their followers, being highly illiterate, are happy with this arrangement, so why should you and I be worried? Years ago, I read that some followers of Hazrat Ali claimed that he was God, but Ali forbade them from saying such a thing. As for grave-worshipping, although it is definitely against the principles of Islam, why is it practised by the majority of Muslims in the sub-continent? As a matter of fact, the Saudis destroyed 3000 to 5000 graves and monuments when they seized power in 1921 (there were demonstrations in undivided India against the Saudis at the time). This proves that even in Arabia (before Saudi rule), grave-worshipping was going on all the time. As for “peers”, they’re like psychiatrists, they advise their followers in all matters. And their followers, being highly illiterate, are happy with this arrangement, so why should you and I be worried?

]]> by: Momina http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276705 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 13:06:50 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276705 sum ameen! sum ameen!

]]> by: Irfan http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276687 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 11:38:59 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276687 The problem lies mainly with Muslims in the sub continent,we have adopted so many bidats in our daily life,most of us have never read and understood the meanings of Quran moreover,we have not even bothered to read the sayings of Holy Prophets(p.b.u.h) that's why we are running afters pir/faqirs etc. Abu Dharr reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Verily there would arise from my Ummah after me or soon after me a group (of people) who would recite the Qar'an, but it would not go beyond their throats, and they would pass clean through their religion just as the arrow passes through the prey, and they would never come back to it. They would be the worst among the creation and the creatures The problem with Muslims in sub continent is that most of them are in search of a "Short cut",no one wants to make any effort. There is a saying of Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) which forbade us from doing what jews and christians have been doing "Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Let there be curse of Allah upon the Jews and the Christians for they have taken the graves of their apostles as places of worship. Now,if Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) has stopped us from making his grave as a place of worship then there is no place, what so ever,in Islam for the graves of those so called pirs/faqirs. There is a misconception among people that,once they will go at the grave of so and so pir,their supplications will be granted.They just do not understand,that a Hindu,an atheist, a non Muslim etc everyone is getting everything in this world,so they also think that they got it coz of so and so idol,but its not the case. Allah Almighty in his infinite mercy is providing sustenance to everyone in this world.So we should only ask Allah Almighty and should not do "sajdas" at graves,which cannot give anything to anyone and should stop worshiping graves. If they read Quran they will come to know that Allah Almighty says in Quran that "any animal sacrificed in any name except Allah Almighty's name is haram". But we see people sacrificing animals on mazars in the name of their pirs/faqirs. We need to put our faith in order before its get too late.We should only ask for the "Shifafat"of Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) on the day of resurrection.Any deed/act which was not practiced by Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) or his Sahabas is Bidaat.We must all pray to Allah Almighty to save us all from all sorts of Bidaats.Ameen. The problem lies mainly with Muslims in the sub continent,we have adopted so many bidats in our daily life,most of us have never read and understood the meanings of Quran moreover,we have not even bothered to read the sayings of Holy Prophets(p.b.u.h) that’s why we are running afters pir/faqirs etc.
Abu Dharr reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: Verily there would arise from my Ummah after me or soon after me a group (of people) who would recite the Qar’an, but it would not go beyond their throats, and they would pass clean through their religion just as the arrow passes through the prey, and they would never come back to it. They would be the worst among the creation and the creatures
The problem with Muslims in sub continent is that most of them are in search of a “Short cut”,no one wants to make any effort.
There is a saying of Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) which forbade us from doing what jews and christians have been doing “Abu Huraira reported: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Let there be curse of Allah upon the Jews and the Christians for they have taken the graves of their apostles as places of worship.
Now,if Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) has stopped us from making his grave as a place of worship then there is no place, what so ever,in Islam for the graves of those so called pirs/faqirs.
There is a misconception among people that,once they will go at the grave of so and so pir,their supplications will be granted.They just do not understand,that a Hindu,an atheist, a non Muslim etc everyone is getting everything in this world,so they also think that they got it coz of so and so idol,but its not the case.
Allah Almighty in his infinite mercy is providing sustenance to everyone in this world.So we should only ask Allah Almighty and should not do “sajdas” at graves,which cannot give anything to anyone and should stop worshiping graves.
If they read Quran they will come to know that Allah Almighty says in Quran that “any animal sacrificed in any name except Allah Almighty’s name is haram”.
But we see people sacrificing animals on mazars in the name of their pirs/faqirs.
We need to put our faith in order before its get too late.We should only ask for the “Shifafat”of Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) on the day of resurrection.Any deed/act which was not practiced by Holy Prophet(p.b.u.h) or his Sahabas is Bidaat.We must all pray to Allah Almighty to save us all from all sorts of Bidaats.Ameen.

]]> by: Momina http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276679 Mon, 03 Aug 2009 09:24:16 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276679 @sunni muslim: May Allah reward you best for this, ameen! @Kashif H: I hope I do justice, insha'Allah. 1-Jinns-Muslim Jinns-pious Muslim Jinns love to be in company of pious Muslim human beings. Muslim Jinns live either in the minarets of masjids or in the houses of pious Muslims because they love to hear when the Qur'an is read and they even learn it that way. Just like human beings. Muhammad s.a.w.w. used to go to deserts and uninhabited areas and recite the Qur'an and preach because that is where Jinns (the general term i mean) mostly live. According to Islamic teachings Human beings should not use Jinns for any purpose whatsoever. Do we like to be used by jinns? No. The same holds true for them as well. Only Sulayman a.s. was given the right to do so by Allah (SWT) and no one else. Once when a shaytaan attacked Muhammad s.a.w.w. While he was praying, the Prophet s.a.w.w. caught hold of him and was about to tie up the jinn when he remembered the du’aa’ of Sulayman a.s. and did not do that. Using the jinn is a power that was given only to Sulayman a.s. Those amils that use Jinns are committing a haraam act. Dealing with the jinn is a serious issue, and is a door that leads to evil and mischief. How often have people are affected by this evil? It is sufficient for one to know that shirk only came to mankind through them. <b>The Prophet s.a.w.w. said, telling us how Allah (SWT) taught His slaves: “ ‘I have created all My slaves with the inclination to worship Me alone, but the devils come to them and turn them away from their religion. They forbid to them that which I have permitted to them, and they tell them to associate others with Me for which I have not sent down any authority.’” [Muslim]</b> One should not turn to the jinn, because that is a means that leads to worshipping them and believing them. Man is fascinated by invisible forces. That may lead to shirk (and has led to shirk on many occasions). Rather we should seek the help of one who is Omni-present and is Able to help - Allah (SWT). some amils do sifli amal to call the jinns...they are usually practitioners of black magic and/or other variety of magic. 2-faal etc is haraam so even if a person uses the Holy Book for this sin it still is a sin...maybe even a bigger sin, Allaho A'lam. Someone told me that one should choose names by istikharah...now we know that istikharah is recommended...but what the person meant is Quranic istikharah (??). it is the same method you have mentioned...so different names to make the wrong deed sound good. We only know of Istikharah (the one known from Sunnah) in Islamic teachings...no other such method. 3-Fortune-tellers: first of all a fortune-teller will try to win a person’s confidence. He will tell them of some past events that have occurred in the victim’s life. How does he do so? The fortune-teller has his shayateen etc with him. These shayateen communicate with the Qareen that is assigned to each individual. The Qareen, of course, knows all about us. He/she has been with us all our lives. This way the confidence is gained. About future, a fortune-teller uses the shayateen, who eavesdrop in the Heavens. Allah (SWT) says in the Qur'an: <b>'Shall I inform you (O people!) Upon whom the devils descend. They descend on every lying, sinful person. Who lends an ear (to the devils and they pour what they may have heard of the Unseen from the angels), and most of them are liars.' (Al-Shu’ara’: 221-223).</b> The shayateen hear some bit of what the angels <i>may</i> have said. That is then passed to the people via the fortune-teller. But to this the shayateen attach so much of lies that there is almost no truth left in it. It is well-known that shayateen are of a very lying nature. Still the people are often prepared to believe what the fortune-teller says. Fortune-telling is considered 'Shirk Akbar' (the major and serious form of polytheism) for two reasons. First, it implies the acquisition of knowledge of the Unseen, which is unique to Allah, alone. Second, it involves using shayateen and holding fast to them, a ritual (sifli amal) that can only be perfected when the performer is in complete submission to the accursed shayateen, which is also a form of polytheism. Allaho A'lam @sunni muslim: May Allah reward you best for this, ameen!

@Kashif H: I hope I do justice, insha’Allah.
1-Jinns-Muslim Jinns-pious Muslim Jinns love to be in company of pious Muslim human beings. Muslim Jinns live either in the minarets of masjids or in the houses of pious Muslims because they love to hear when the Qur’an is read and they even learn it that way. Just like human beings. Muhammad s.a.w.w. used to go to deserts and uninhabited areas and recite the Qur’an and preach because that is where Jinns (the general term i mean) mostly live.

According to Islamic teachings Human beings should not use Jinns for any purpose whatsoever. Do we like to be used by jinns? No. The same holds true for them as well. Only Sulayman a.s. was given the right to do so by Allah (SWT) and no one else. Once when a shaytaan attacked Muhammad s.a.w.w. While he was praying, the Prophet s.a.w.w. caught hold of him and was about to tie up the jinn when he remembered the du’aa’ of Sulayman a.s. and did not do that. Using the jinn is a power that was given only to Sulayman a.s.

Those amils that use Jinns are committing a haraam act.
Dealing with the jinn is a serious issue, and is a door that leads to evil and mischief. How often have people are affected by this evil? It is sufficient for one to know that shirk only came to mankind through them. The Prophet s.a.w.w. said, telling us how Allah (SWT) taught His slaves: “ ‘I have created all My slaves with the inclination to worship Me alone, but the devils come to them and turn them away from their religion. They forbid to them that which I have permitted to them, and they tell them to associate others with Me for which I have not sent down any authority.’” [Muslim]

One should not turn to the jinn, because that is a means that leads to worshipping them and believing them. Man is fascinated by invisible forces. That may lead to shirk (and has led to shirk on many occasions).
Rather we should seek the help of one who is Omni-present and is Able to help - Allah (SWT).

some amils do sifli amal to call the jinns…they are usually practitioners of black magic and/or other variety of magic.

2-faal etc is haraam so even if a person uses the Holy Book for this sin it still is a sin…maybe even a bigger sin, Allaho A’lam. Someone told me that one should choose names by istikharah…now we know that istikharah is recommended…but what the person meant is Quranic istikharah (??). it is the same method you have mentioned…so different names to make the wrong deed sound good. We only know of Istikharah (the one known from Sunnah) in Islamic teachings…no other such method.

3-Fortune-tellers: first of all a fortune-teller will try to win a person’s confidence. He will tell them of some past events that have occurred in the victim’s life. How does he do so? The fortune-teller has his shayateen etc with him. These shayateen communicate with the Qareen that is assigned to each individual. The Qareen, of course, knows all about us. He/she has been with us all our lives. This way the confidence is gained.

About future, a fortune-teller uses the shayateen, who eavesdrop in the Heavens. Allah (SWT) says in the Qur’an: ‘Shall I inform you (O people!) Upon whom the devils descend. They descend on every lying, sinful person. Who lends an ear (to the devils and they pour what they may have heard of the Unseen from the angels), and most of them are liars.’ (Al-Shu’ara’: 221-223).

The shayateen hear some bit of what the angels may have said. That is then passed to the people via the fortune-teller. But to this the shayateen attach so much of lies that there is almost no truth left in it. It is well-known that shayateen are of a very lying nature. Still the people are often prepared to believe what the fortune-teller says.

Fortune-telling is considered ‘Shirk Akbar’ (the major and serious form of polytheism) for two reasons. First, it implies the acquisition of knowledge of the Unseen, which is unique to Allah, alone.
Second, it involves using shayateen and holding fast to them, a ritual (sifli amal) that can only be perfected when the performer is in complete submission to the accursed shayateen, which is also a form of polytheism.

Allaho A’lam

]]> by: Kashif H http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276556 Sun, 02 Aug 2009 13:40:45 +0000 http://www.chowrangi.com/pir-babas.html#comment-276556 Here are a couple of questions I could think of to carry this discussion forward since they relate to pir babas or pious people. The term pir baba is now infamous due to quacks but is also used for spiritually enlightened people till to date. 1-The pious Muslims are ALSO said to have jinns. These are good jinns it is told. They don't harm or in some cases don't help the pious man but are in his company and at his disposal. How true is that? On the contrary some say Jinns are only with Amils and Amil is the person who is not spiritual rather he practices wrong things to please shaytan and thereby shaytan offers him some services. These people are spread all over. The charge for their services. 2-What is Quraani Faal? (opening of any page of Quran randomly after reciting some dua and reading any random ayat that contains message for the seeker of knowledge and help from Allah) Is there any religious noting for that in sharah? 3- When Prophet Solomon (may Allah be pleased with him) died he had several shiateen at his disposal from whom he took labor that pained them. He did that for punishing them. These Shiateen didnt know when he expired until they saw that his walking stick crumbled and he fell on ground since he was leaning on it. Now people say jins know future. Masses ask pious people for their decisions if they will be good or bad for them. These people ask whom? if jins then its evident in Quran that jins dont know future. Example cited above. If they dont ask jins whom they ask? Because many people are believers in this and the swear its true. they are people like us educated folk with reasoning and logic and we cannot just turn them down without our won reasoning. Kindly comment! Here are a couple of questions I could think of to carry this discussion forward since they relate to pir babas or pious people. The term pir baba is now infamous due to quacks but is also used for spiritually enlightened people till to date.

1-The pious Muslims are ALSO said to have jinns. These are good jinns it is told. They don’t harm or in some cases don’t help the pious man but are in his company and at his disposal. How true is that? On the contrary some say Jinns are only with Amils and Amil is the person who is not spiritual rather he practices wrong things to please shaytan and thereby shaytan offers him some services. These people are spread all over. The charge for their services.

2-What is Quraani Faal? (opening of any page of Quran randomly after reciting some dua and reading any random ayat that contains message for the seeker of knowledge and help from Allah) Is there any religious noting for that in sharah?

3- When Prophet Solomon (may Allah be pleased with him) died he had several shiateen at his disposal from whom he took labor that pained them. He did that for punishing them. These Shiateen didnt know when he expired until they saw that his walking stick crumbled and he fell on ground since he was leaning on it. Now people say jins know future. Masses ask pious people for their decisions if they will be good or bad for them. These people ask whom? if jins then its evident in Quran that jins dont know future. Example cited above. If they dont ask jins whom they ask? Because many people are believers in this and the swear its true. they are people like us educated folk with reasoning and logic and we cannot just turn them down without our won reasoning.

Kindly comment!

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